American Idol is hush hush about it's contract,because it received some negative publicity. They say it's better now than it was in 2004..but what do we know about it? I think Elliott is better off without it. Here's the 2004 version as summed up by CNN. Also Salon Magazine had a spill on it as well.
Clay Aiken said he didn't get any cash as runner up.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Music/01/2...c.idolmaker.ap/

Another section of the "American Idol" contract Fine disclosed described the aggressive image manipulation the performers must agree to, stating that the show "may reveal and/or relate information about me of a personal, private, intimate, surprising, defamatory, disparaging, embarrassing or unfavorable nature, that may be factual and/or fictional."

That quote above is what stuck out most to me...they can MAKE THINGS UP that is unfavorable, disparaging, defamatory, intimate, etc. about the contestants. Wow. They can say any damn thing they want about these contestants, and there doesn't seem to be much the contestants can do about it...it's in the contract they signed.

Wow.

This Fuller guy is smart and seemingly sleezy........He makes a fortune off these kids......but is this forever? I was under the impression it was just a year for AI and runner up and 3 months for the other remaining ones. Someone on another thread did say that Elliott had said it would just be 3 months........

I think the deal stinks. They do all the work and the big guys collect mucho bucks.
And note, once again, the facts are hidden........seems this is the way AI runs......sneaky.

Why would anyone sign such a contract??????????????? It's like selling the soul to the devil.......they can say anything they want, doesn't' have to be true. Well, that may clarify the percentages we saw.........they can do whatever they want to do to get what they want.............ok,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,not believing in this show anymore..........not gonna watch it after this coming week......the heck with next season.......it's a joke at best but these kids are paying a high price for it.......
Now I am sure Kat will win this thing........nuttin gonna stop em........

last I heard winner and runner up are ai slaves for 7 years or until they get dropped from the label...

But let's have a look at some of the more exciting fine print in the "American Idol" contestant contract, which was posted on the "Pho" e-mail group by Los Angeles music attorney Gary Fine.

Fine came into possession of the contract when the mother of a young man who was interested in being on the show brought it in for his perusal. The contract had been presented on a "take it or leave it" basis and the man had been given a couple of hours to make a decision. Fine told him not to sign.

"1. I hereby consent to Producer's filming, taping and/or recording of me for use in and in connection with the Series ... I acknowledge and agree that Producer will be the sole and exclusive owner of all rights and material filmed, taped, and/or recorded pursuant to this Agreement.

"... I hereby grant to Producer the unconditional right throughout the universe in perpetuity to use, simulate or portray (and to authorize others to do so) or to refrain from using, simulating or portraying, my name, likeness (whether photographic or otherwise), voice, singing voice, personality, personal identification or personal experiences, my life story, biographical data, incidents, situations and events which heretofore occurred or hereafter occur, including without limitation the right to use, or to authorize others to use any of the foregoing in or in connection with the Series ...

"... I understand that, in and in connection with the Series, I may reveal and/or relate, and other parties ... may reveal and/or relate information about me of a personal, private, intimate, surprising, defamatory, disparaging, embarrassing or unfavorable nature, that may be factual and/or fictional."

In other words, the producers can record any and all behavior of the contestant "in and in connection with the series" and use the contestant's likeness, voice and any or all biographical material, whether true or false, any way they want to. The producers own all this material forever and "throughout the universe."

"2. Confidentiality/Disclosures: Any and all information disclosed to or obtained by me concerning or relating to the Series, the contestants, the events contained in the Series, the outcome of the Series and/or contest, Producer, the Network and the terms and conditions of this Agreement shall be strictly confidential.

" ... I acknowledge that any disclosure of such information will constitute a material breach of this Agreement and will cause Producer and the Network substantial and irreparable Injury and will cause substantial damages in excess of Five Million Dollars ($5,000,000), entitling Producer (and/or the Network, as a third party beneficiary of this provision) to, among other things: (a) injunctive or other equitable relief, without posting any bond, to prevent and/or cure any breach or threatened breach of this paragraph by me; (B) recovery or disgorgement of the monies and other consideration, if any, I received in connection with such disclosure; © forfeiture of any and all cash and prizes that I may have been entitled to for participating in the Series; and (d) recovery of the Producer's and/or the Network's damages, including but not limited to, lost profits and other consequential damages, to the extent permitted by law, and attorneys' fees and court costs incurred to enforce this paragraph."

Absolutely all information regarding the show and this contract is confidential. If the contestant breaches this confidentiality it will cause damages assumed to be in excess of $5 million. The producers can recover such damages, anything gained by the contestant from such a disclosure, the contestant's winnings from the show and any actual additional damages caused by the disclosure.
"5. Future Agreements: Notwithstanding the other provisions of this Section C, I understand and agree that in the event I am one of the final ten (10) contestants in the Competition, I will be required to enter into the following agreements: (a) an agreement with 19 Recordings Ltd. (or an affiliated company) for my exclusive services as a recording artist; (B) an agreement with 19 Merchandising Ltd. for the use of my name, likeness biography in connection with advertising, endorsement, merchandising and sponsorship; and © an agreement with 19 Management Ltd. for the management of my career as an artist. I understand and agree that, unless I am the individual selected as the winner of the Competition, such agreements shall become fully effective only at the election of 19 Recordings Ltd., 19 Merchandising Ltd. and/or 19 Management Ltd."

Each of the 10 finalists was required to enter into agreements exclusively with 19 Recordings as recording artist; 19 Merchandising for advertising, endorsements, sponsorships and merchandising; and 19 Management for the management of his or her career. All this was entirely at the option of the 19 companies, save for the winner, who was guaranteed this result.

"6. 'World Idol': I acknowledge and agree that, should I win the Competition and subject to my availability at the time of the Producer's request, I shall participate in a 'World Idol' program where winners/contestants from the 'Pop Idol' and/or 'American Idol' competition in other countries or other versions of the Series shall compete against each other and, provided that I appear on the 'World Idol' program, I agree to accept a total fee of One Thousand Four Hundred Dollars ($1,400.00) in full and final consideration for my appearance in such program and the grant of all rights in relation thereto on the same terms and conditions set out hereunder."

This one's amazing. Basically, if I win "American Idol," I promise to appear on the "World Idol" show -- for a total fee of $1,400! All the provisions of this contract will apply to that show as well.



"5. Future Agreements: Notwithstanding the other provisions of this Section C, I understand and agree that in the event I am one of the final ten (10) contestants in the Competition, I will be required to enter into the following agreements: (a) an agreement with 19 Recordings Ltd. (or an affiliated company) for my exclusive services as a recording artist; (B) an agreement with 19 Merchandising Ltd. for the use of my name, likeness biography in connection with advertising, endorsement, merchandising and sponsorship; and © an agreement with 19 Management Ltd. for the management of my career as an artist. I understand and agree that, unless I am the individual selected as the winner of the Competition, such agreements shall become fully effective only at the election of 19 Recordings Ltd., 19 Merchandising Ltd. and/or 19 Management Ltd."

Each of the 10 finalists was required to enter into agreements exclusively with 19 Recordings as recording artist; 19 Merchandising for advertising, endorsements, sponsorships and merchandising; and 19 Management for the management of his or her career. All this was entirely at the option of the 19 companies, save for the winner, who was guaranteed this result.

"6. 'World Idol': I acknowledge and agree that, should I win the Competition and subject to my availability at the time of the Producer's request, I shall participate in a 'World Idol' program where winners/contestants from the 'Pop Idol' and/or 'American Idol' competition in other countries or other versions of the Series shall compete against each other and, provided that I appear on the 'World Idol' program, I agree to accept a total fee of One Thousand Four Hundred Dollars ($1,400.00) in full and final consideration for my appearance in such program and the grant of all rights in relation thereto on the same terms and conditions set out hereunder."

This one's amazing. Basically, if I win "American Idol," I promise to appear on the "World Idol" show -- for a total fee of $1,400! All the provisions of this contract will apply to that show as well.



http://dir.salon.com/story/ent/feature/200...index.html?pn=1

That's my favourite part, I guess life really does exist beyond Earth ;)

Nah, that's just a codicil in case they want to project the image of an idol on to the moon...


KTK CAMPAIGN :clubbed:

Hey Squeegee, Dulce here...

From what I understand, they've changed the contract slightly. They'd have to. Clarkson and Aiken hired their own team of lawyers to get them out of their contracts with 19E and apparently there was enough of a loophole for them to do it. I highly doubt that the loophole still exists since Clarkson and Aiken came from seasons 1 and 2 respectively.

Kelly stated that 19E and Simon Fuller never paid her enough attention and I can only assume what Clay's reasoning was, but I'm sure it went along the same lines. Both had to fight for what they wanted and well, look where Kelly Clarkson is right now.

19E, Clive Davis --> they are all in cahoots to make money. That's all they want. They could care less about long term career success. Clive mentions Kelly as a long term success but keep in mind that she's only been around for 4 years, so if that's Clive's idea of long term then well, everyone is toast.

I know everyone is worried about Elliott's chances at a deal, but he's not a flash in the pan kind of artist ala. Ace, Kellie, possibly Katharine and Tay. He's the REAL deal, the REAL musician whose actually there not to be a star, but for the music. He will get noticed and he will get signed by someone who cares enough to give him that long-term shot that 19E won't. El's talent needs to be molded, yes, but it's there in spades and in ways that only come innately to those with a God given ability.

The simple fact that practically every artist stuck with 19E has tanked from AI says something. Who got away from them? Kelly Clarkson --> wins a grammy. Clay Aiken --> still sings to sold out crowds; Claynation still going strong. Kimberly Locke --> decent career as a top 40 artist, modeling etc.; I don't know about Gracin but I've seen his name on the charts as well. Jasmine Trias did not get signed and is now a HUUUGGGEEEE success overseas. She sells out stadiums overseas. Who couldn't get away from 19E? Tamyra Gray, Justin Guarini, Bo Bice etc. You get the picture.

I don't think they want him. Clive doesn't "get" him and I think Elliott's outright refusal to change his song told Clive everything he needed to know about Elliott's musical integrity: that he has lots of it and Clive is powerless against Elliott's love of good music.

Clive better go peck somewhere else to go ruin another career.

I read somewhere that they extended the contract from a year to seven years. Some say its still one year..anyone know how long the contract really lasts?

i dont think they can make things up, persay. but i think whatever they find out about these kids' personal lives is fair game to the public.

The more I hear about this contract, the MORE convinced I am that Elliott WANTED things to happen just this way, and the happier I am for E.

Oh yes, they CAN make things up...it says "factual and/or fictional", so they do reserve the right to make up any story they want to, and there isn't much, under that provision, that the contestant can say or do about it.

Do I believe that they actually DO make things up? Not out of whole cloth, no. But I do believe that they embellish certain stories rather freely and stray from the truth pretty frequently.

Signing the AI Contract feels like selling your soul to Satan. hehehe.

from what i understand [a friend of a friend was going to audition in 2002, but declined after reading the contract] the contractual obligation to sign with 19|clive isn't for too long [i've heard 3 months after the final to a year. not sure which] but ai gets a 10% cut FOREVER. IN WHATEVER THEY DECIDE TO DO musically or otherwise. because according to them, they wouldn't be doing anything [selling records, doing movies etc] if idol hadn't gotten them the start. so it's like they owe idol for life :no:

Clive is Satan and 19 is hell.

That's just bad. Didn't Kelly and Clay sued their way out of their contracts? If that is true then I hope Elliott does the same.

Well, I am now go glad that Elliott did not make the finals since they would relly own his gentle soul - it sounded to me like if they did not sign him by the end of the tour in August , he is a free agent .Per that horrific contract he may have to pay 19E forever but that is better than being owned by them outright !

What kind of layers do they have that write up this crap - a Satanic cult of attorneys ? What a load of crap that contract is - it must take a lot to make yourself sign it !

I guess Justin Guarini has been very negative about AI - saw that on Google yesterday and Kelly gives them no credit and never acknowledged they gave her a start - I think these kids feel used and are bitter and rightfully so .

You know, I sure hope Clive doesn't do a 180 and change his mind about signing Elliott. I'm a little worried about this. E is getting more press/publicity now than ever and Wed. results show was the true "AI Moment" of the season. I've gone from being very said to very happy for E in a matter of a few days and it would be a real let-down if he indeed got stuck with Clive & 19E.

Yeah..I kinda fear that Clive may just change his mind and sign Elliott just for him not to serve as competition to other Idol contestants. If he sign him, he may just put him on the shelf and let him fall into obscurity.

i have this sinking feeling that clive will sign e, start his album but get caught up in red tape and never finish it so he can hide e for four years so he doesn't get in the way of the "golden" idols.

oh lord, i just gave myself a mini heart attack.

ok - here's an outrageous theory (i'm sure it's not true - but just for conversation's sake) What if a couple of people like Simon and Randy truly appreciated E and manipulated the season because they thought he deserved better than the crap CD's that AI creates? By the end of the season there was no doubt that E was loved, appreciated and very marketable. On every BLOG for USA Today, etc folks said E's was the CD they would buy. What do you think?

I think the judges liked Elliott.. even Simon. But I don't think they're that nice to do that. Well if they help Elliott in having a successful music career then their will be no doubt that they truly liked and cared for Elliott.

I for one don't believe that Clive IS going to change his mind and sign Elliott. I think he didn't like him, and I never felt that Nigel liked him, either. (I do think the judges liked him, even Simon.) I think that, especially after his refusal to change his song choice on Tuesday night, they probably don't want to work with him. I think Elliott is a good man, and sweet as can be...but I also think he definitely has the courage to stand up for his convictions and not back down. I think they are looking for someone who wants to be big, who will be amenable to being molded and packaged by 19E into a pop star, and Elliott is not that man.

The contract is going to be interesting for Princess Kat. I am sure she doensn't like people telling her what to do. But then again, I guess Daddy McWarbucks will be able to take care of it for her.

Somebody at TwoP posted this as an assumption as to why Clive Davis doesn't like Elliott. I, for one, think he/she is spot on. :P

"I think Clive really despised Elliott for some reason - maybe Elliott's vulnerability and decency forced Clive to a semi-recognition of his own innate lack of any trace of goodness."

Whay do you guys think? Personally, after reading this kind of "Give Us Your Firstborn Son" contract, it's in Elliott's best interest to be able to pursue other offers. Oh, and seriously, whoever drafted this contract should be sent to rot in hell for eternity. How could they live with themselves? :angry:

What kind of lawyer? Clive Davis.
Read this about Clive Davis, it's an eye-opener.

http://www.coconuts.com/namepage.aspx?pid=...ype=P&loc=41159

Yes, everything happens for a reason. I'm glad E sang IBITMS-- seemed like the best send off :clubbed:

As for the editing with Clive- I think the key word is FUTURE projects- E is a smart guy and you never want to burn any bridges.

so here's a link to Universal's site:

http://new.umusic.com/labels.aspx?Group=1

I think this would be the perfect label for E... let's hope the rumors are true...

Ahah!!!!!Now I know why Clive Davis reminds me of everyones sleezy uncle(com'n and get some candy little children , type). Thank God he DIDN'T choose Elliott.E is a REAL ARTIST, run Elliott,run! :poke:

I know!!! Clive is losing his touch in my opinion! :poke:

Run E!!!! :rotfl:

I saw Dave geffen's name on that other record company site...I read somewhere that he's a very creative soul.

Has anyone ever thought of this possibility? Maybe the fact that Ellliott's legion of fans adores him so much and are so protective of him, coupled with the fact that HE actually has a backbone, has made him unappealing to 19 entertainment. They know they would have to treat Elliott decently or face the wrath of his E-fans.

1. Just hearing (and I didn't bother to listen to much of it) Clive ramble on about how many "units" have been sold due to the AI show tells it all, doesn't it? It's not about PEOPLE and artistry, it's about money. (The greatest lesson in this life is that doing what's right by people will always bring you what you need...and what you need is always enough when you have people.)

2. I would like a definitive answer to the question of how LONG any of the top ten are obligated to sign with 19 after the competition is over. Anybody know? JLyn, you have industry experience....can you tell us?

3. There's no way that anyone can get a percentage of the earnings of a person into perpetuity. That is surely a major loophole in the contract, if it really says that regarding earnings. I think this is basically applicable only to what is generated from the AI show and the time a contestant is on it and signed to 19, NOT after that.

4. As Dulce said, if Clarkson and Aiken got out of the contract, the contract has to have been changed, now. Seems a shame that a person is required to forfeit his or her free speech rights regarding talking about AI and the program (another loophole, I guess). I'm sure they all have to be very careful. Then again, once a person is on his own and earning zillions a year, it might be worth forking over $5 million in damages just to speak out and ruin the show, huh? Sounds like a plan. :bricks:

All I know is that Elliott did not look himself for the first two songs of the competition last week. He has said he was tired, did not feel comfortable singing the songs, etc. But, there was something in his eyes. The photo of his face when he saw the results has not impressed me like it has others as being "at peace" or "with a smile." He looks completely resigned in a very sad way, but that's how he looked the entire evening. In any case we may never know all of what goes on since the bondage by AI continues forever. Maybe when the show folds, we will hear the truth.

I really appreciate this thread. Any other FACTS out there, would really like to hear them.....imagine us being able to actually REVEAL and DISCUSS them here...can you imagine what would have happened to Parsimmon's post at that OTHER place? :2guns: :kitty5:

Oh, no, honey. The deal is for five years. However, both Kelly and Clay proved that you can break it.

I think that Clive doesn't like Elliott because he won't compromise who he is as an artist. If you look at all of the other winners and runners-up from AI, the Ancient One TOTALLY changed who they were, and in some cases, they were not very successful as their core fan base was totally turned off by their CDs. I'm GLAD he isn't interested in Elliott. I love Elliott just the way he is: an honest, raw performer.

Yes I totally agree with you. In fact, Clive TOLD us what his problem is with Elliott. Elliott actually TRIES TO BE DIFFERENT (horrors).

(Elliott said something about working with Clive on future projects to be polite. There was no fire in his eyes when he said that. He was like a little boy at the principal's office.)

The most annoying thing about all this IMO is that we can only speculate (I'm crashing your thread..hope you don't mind).. on how long the contract is binding. I've heard that 19E has first rights to sign any of them thru Aug26th (once the tour is over) & IF 19E doesn't exercise that option then the kids are free to walk. I have read that once that contract is signed the signee will be fined five million by 19E for discussing the contents of the contract with anyone...( which would explain the jaded way in which Chris & Co discuss future plans with anyone..they aren't allowed to flat out say.."well I'm contractually bound to 19E & am not allowed to take offers until Aug 26th..but they might sign me anyway so I'm screwed"..)

I didn't know about the 10% for life..I knew about the rights to their identity but I presumed that once Aug 26th passes and presuming they are not signed they were free citizens to shop around for their own deals. That would be truly shitty to have to keep paying Simon (the pimp daddy) 10% for the rest of your life just for being on his show. It's not great whichever way you look at it.

Elliott was very complimentary regarding the show after his WYWDFL encore performance, showing his gratitude, etc. I get the feeling the kid just wants to sing..he's not looking for fame & glory. I think he just wants sing for a living. Which is something quite special today.
I'm looking forward to seeing him sing live one day in some exquisute jazz R/B club. Not a big place,..in New York somewhere...happy with his vocation in life, happy with the music & he sings to me.

But, something is bothering me. Why would Amanda and Elliott WANT Taylor to win and be subject to this if this is really that bad of a deal?

I believe that this is the only way Taylor would get a recording contract, personally and maybe he would actually enjoy getting whatever he could get. I know Amanda and E would never say that, and I would never presume to put that thought into anyone's head. I just don't think Taylor has a good voice at all...relative to the artists I've grown up with and those Iwould buy today.

Actually, I think it would be a "good" thing for Katherine to win just to assure she is stuck with this a long time (of course, the McParents would get her out of it the moment she becomes a real star --- IF that were to happen).

Hmmm...maybe I should vote for Katherine. :rotfl:

you know, the way I look at it, is that the 19E pool is becoming more & more diluted. Each year the new 'Idol' has to compete with last year's Idol who is already competing with the year before's Idol & so on. No one has touched Kelly's success yet..because she was the first. The more people 19E represents the weaker the pool becomes...JMO.