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 Netiquette/staying On Topic
Taratova
Posted: Jun 3 2008, 10:03 AM


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I am VERY thankful for the Moderators of E-Train. Without the guidelines, rules, etc. it could be the AOL boards. That was horrific!!

I believe the mods do a great job here . Sure, once in a while we have a rift or misunderstanding on what we perceive as offensive to our personal thinking,but it is not a constant problem. It is for the most part very positive . elliottcap2.gif






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My soul was stirred. It took the voice of Elliott Yamin to wake up my senses and bring me back into the world of music.
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LilRedDevilLizzy
Posted: Jun 3 2008, 10:20 AM


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QUOTE (itslate @ Jun 3 2008, 10:55 AM)
There are guidlines listed in Off the Record.

Please read: http://etrainstation.com/index.php?showtopic=5949

OFE, I like that it includes use PM's.

I do not think that any of these rules have been broken in this thread.
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onlyforelliott
Posted: Jun 3 2008, 11:38 AM


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QUOTE (Taratova @ Jun 3 2008, 10:03 AM)
I am VERY thankful for the Moderators of E-Train. Without the guidelines, rules, etc. it could be the AOL boards. That was horrific!!

I believe the mods do a great job here . Sure, once in a while we have a rift or misunderstanding on what we perceive as offensive to our personal thinking,but it is not a constant problem. It is for the most part very positive . elliottcap2.gif

Taratova,

I agree that the mods do a great job. Here is another guideline from the Linux forum:

DO NOT FLAME THE STAFF
They have the final say. This forum isn't a democracy. Your vote doesn't always count. They try to please everyone they can, but in the end, they're charged with making this community as enjoyable for as many people as they possibly can. They can not always be right, nor can they please everyone with the decisions made, but they're doing their "jobs" and hopefully we can all agree that they're doing their best to ensure a good community here.

If you feel that an egregious oversight has been made, then pm the moderator group. Do not post complaints on the forum.


Reference: http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Forum_Etiquette
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LilRedDevilLizzy
Posted: Jun 3 2008, 11:42 AM


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QUOTE (onlyforelliott @ Jun 3 2008, 12:38 PM)
QUOTE (Taratova @ Jun 3 2008, 10:03 AM)
I am VERY thankful for the Moderators of E-Train. Without the guidelines, rules, etc. it could be the AOL boards. That was horrific!! 

I believe the mods do a great job here .  Sure, once in a while we have a rift or misunderstanding  on what we perceive as offensive to our personal thinking,but it is not a constant problem.  It is for the most part very positive . elliottcap2.gif

Taratova,

I agree that the mods do a great job. Here is another guideline from the Linux forum:

DO NOT FLAME THE STAFF
They have the final say. This forum isn't a democracy. Your vote doesn't always count. They try to please everyone they can, but in the end, they're charged with making this community as enjoyable for as many people as they possibly can. They can not always be right, nor can they please everyone with the decisions made, but they're doing their "jobs" and hopefully we can all agree that they're doing their best to ensure a good community here.

If you feel that an egregious oversight has been made, then pm the moderator group. Do not post complaints on the forum.


Reference: http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Forum_Etiquette

Again, you are trying to make it seem like this took place. And again, it did not.
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realitymom
Posted: Jun 3 2008, 12:48 PM


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QUOTE (LilRedDevilLizzy @ Jun 3 2008, 06:58 AM)



And someone said that it was better that Jackies "issue" was discussed in OTR so that others didnt know. Why? So that people didn't know some E-trainers misbehaved? Right, we wouldn't want that to get out.

Actually, no Etrianers have misbehaved on THIS SITE, as NOTHING has been posted negative about Jackie in any way. People on this site who read posts STILL have NO IDEA what happened to hurt Jackie & as it appears it was private & personal, they SHOULDN'T. Which is why I said PERHAPS it WAS a good idea to move it to OTR, so that if anything personal did get mentioned, it wouldn't be for everyone to read. Lord forgive me, I have compassion & tact.

And Jabu was justified in what he said. The manager of this site blew off the manager of the other site by saying there were other things to deal with. BS. Yes everyone was grieving, and noone knows how any one was actually grieving, but it was a BS answer to the issue.

Justified? Right. The comment was rude & inconsiderate. Period. And, BTW, I was not offended, I was PISSED.

And now I have managed to veer off topic.

As for the mods, w/ all this uproar & for all the complaining of not getting to give opinions, I am reading posts from all sides. Seems pretty dayum open to me. So mods, KUDOS to you, cause I do NOT have the patience ya'll have. (Or the ability to hold my tongue.)



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Thanks to emjay for the gorgeous banner...loves ya girl!



ELLIOTT YAMIN IS MY AMERICAN IDOL!!
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yellin4yamin
Posted: Jun 3 2008, 01:11 PM


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QUOTE (realitymom @ Jun 3 2008, 05:48 PM)
QUOTE (LilRedDevilLizzy @ Jun 3 2008, 06:58 AM)



And someone said that it was better that Jackies "issue" was discussed in OTR so that others didnt know. Why? So that people didn't know some E-trainers misbehaved? Right, we wouldn't want that to get out.

Actually, no Etrianers have misbehaved on THIS SITE, as NOTHING has been posted negative about Jackie in any way. People on this site who read posts STILL have NO IDEA what happened to hurt Jackie & as it appears it was private & personal, they SHOULDN'T. Which is why I said PERHAPS it WAS a good idea to move it to OTR, so that if anything personal did get mentioned, it wouldn't be for everyone to read. Lord forgive me, I have compassion & tact.

And Jabu was justified in what he said. The manager of this site blew off the manager of the other site by saying there were other things to deal with. BS. Yes everyone was grieving, and noone knows how any one was actually grieving, but it was a BS answer to the issue.

Justified? Right. The comment was rude & inconsiderate. Period. And, BTW, I was not offended, I was PISSED.

And now I have managed to veer off topic.

As for the mods, w/ all this uproar & for all the complaining of not getting to give opinions, I am reading posts from all sides. Seems pretty dayum open to me. So mods, KUDOS to you, cause I do NOT have the patience ya'll have. (Or the ability to hold my tongue.)

Amen.

The way I see it is if anyone has a problem with someone personally on the boards, it should be taken to that person with a PM and dealt with with that person. How they decide to handle it I guess is up to them and between them personally, not to be drug on here so that those that have no clue what is going on, can sit and wonder who did what. That just isn't fair to the rest of the e-train family.

What Jabu said was EXTREMELY hurtful, and to insinuate that a member of management (a mod) is NOT Elliott, and that he/she may not be really "grieving" or grieving in the right way is just sad and that IS taking a personal stab at a mod/member of the E-train. The mods here take their free time to help run this place, in the best way possible, but they do have lives outside of here that may impact the way they are feeling personally at a certain time. Brandon was friends with Elliott WAYYYYY before this place ever came about, and he and loth built this place out of their LOVE for Elliott. How is someone to know, or judge, or say the way he handled something so personal was BS? The man has always gone above and beyond to share respectfully, news about Elliott when it is learned, and he has always had Elliott's best interest at heart, and isn't that what it is all about...ELLIOTT??

We are all human, none of us are perfect. But let me just say that I belong to 4 different band/artist boards and this one is by FAR the most fun, respectfully, kindly, and lovingly run and what is wrong with that? I tip my hats off to the mods, for giving all they do so freely every single day for Elliott, and for us.


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user posted image
we are all shades of gray. it's been said again and again; life's a process. we are fleeting moments that come and go, and I'm grateful to have my time, my aspirations and mistakes, my flaws and my abilities. think of me what you will, but before you do, don't."
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LilRedDevilLizzy
Posted: Jun 3 2008, 01:54 PM


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You are entitled to your opinion, and I'm only entitled to mine as long as it agrees with yours? That is the jist of what I am getting.

You all want everything to go away but you keep setting it up so that there will be more responses. I am sorry but I'm not rising to the bait.

BTW: I never said that E-trainers misbehaved on this site. Thanks for acknowledging they misbehaved though.

Enjoy living your life behind rose colored glasses.
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kbug
Posted: Jun 3 2008, 03:51 PM


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Actually eTrainers did not misbehave on this site - 100% true.

They went to another Elliott site and misbehaved - which is how this particular issue came about in the first place. By actions of eTrainers - 100% true.

People still wonder why this problem is being addressed here. No one has taken the trouble to go to the other site and try to resolve things. PMs didn't work, contacting the site admin. didn't work. Seriously, if anyone has an idea that you think would work please speak up - people are coming here for resolution because all the usual adult ways of dealing with conflict haven't worked. Yet, the ones who are bold enough to speak out about it are considered trouble makers.

Labeling fellow Elliott fans as trolls certainly isn't the answer.

You would think things could be resolved as adults, discussed and some sort of resolution being the end result.

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Ging
Posted: Jun 3 2008, 07:01 PM


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Sorry for all the peeps who have been hurt and upset.

I agree with Tara in that I like this site and I appreciate all of the mods that give their time to make it a nice place.

I also agree that there has to be rules or this place would wind up like the AOL board with no rules and terrible things being posted about Idols and other members.

I think that the Updates & News Section should be just that and more personal discussions as this should be moved to a more appropriate place. I would be happy if the Updates & News contained only News, Updates and POSITIVE comments about Elliott, other Idols and Members with all Negative comments of any kind being moved, but that is just my opinion and I am sure that other's have different opinions ! peace.gif

This post has been edited by Ging on Jun 4 2008, 01:44 AM


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SoulMusicRocks
Posted: Jun 3 2008, 07:25 PM


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I think what constitutes negativity is subjective. Some people feel constructive criticism is positive and beneficial while others view it as a hinderance. As many people through this thread have said.....as long as we are respectful towards one another (even when we disagree) things should be good.

This post has been edited by SoulMusicRocks on Jun 3 2008, 07:26 PM
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bigEfan
Posted: Jun 3 2008, 11:43 PM


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Ok, I have to defend Jabu since he has been put in moderation and unable to post.

This guy is a die-hard passionate Elliott fan from Peru. He is the sweetest guy, funny, and has a very kind heart. You guys don't know him, thus your assumptions and maybe his post was taken out of context related to a little language barrier.

He did NOT mean to make light of Brandon's, Elliott's or anyones grieving. I can speak for everyone at the Flipside and say that we all shared tears over poor Claudette's passing and most importantly were hurting for Elliott. Having just lost my dad a few months ago, I could also feel Elliott's pain deeply. I've lost both my parents now and I just feel alone as I am an only child as well. But, that has nothing to do with this. So......

Jabu did not want or mean to come off as being heartless or mean. If you knew him, you would know this is far from the truth. He was essentially defending Jackie and trying to convey that things were not handled as properly behind the scenes as many of Jackie's friends thought they should have been. None of this would have came to light if things were handled as they should have been a couple months ago when private messages were sent and resolutions were attempted.

So, let me ask y'all a couple final questions. How would you feel if you shared very private matters in a protected thread here at the etrain and then someone from another fansite came over, dug thru your personal posts, made lunch time gossip and probably even more of them(breaking the board rules while they were at it), made judgements that you were being disrepectful to Elliott when it didn't have one thing to do with Elliott or being an Elliott fan? If you were a friend of that person that was hurt or a member of that board, would you not defend them and call out those that wronged them along with feeling your board and privacy had been violated? Would you not want to see apologies made, the username of the person who violated the terms of the private threads handed over? Just some food for thought.

I really do like a lot of people here but I've really had enough. I don't want this all to spoil my own love for Elliott and his music.


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Priceless quote by bigEfan after just hearing Elliott sing live, " I officially love Elliott Yamin MORE than I EVER have!"
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LilRedDevilLizzy
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 10:45 AM


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So here goes, I'm sure that I broke a rule in sharing with Jabu the attacks against him, but I have to say that I don't care if that causes me trouble here. Jabu means more ot me than that.

It was wrong to move the thread to a part of the site he couldn't access to explain himself. To flame and pass judgement on him when he can't respond is unfair and uncaused him. Especially since he is on moderation for some reason.

Here is Jabu's response.

This is Jabu here. I want to reply to some of you, especially realitymom, who doesnít seem to keep things under reality that much.

Iím asking another member to post this because Iíve been put under moderation. I guess itís because of my last post, which led you to consider me a troll. Funny thing, you didnít consider me a troll when I came here encouraging you to vote for Elliott in the Idol Madness poll months ago. Now, I don't mean to be rude, but if you attack me, I'll reply.

I must say Iím pissed off and disappointed at you all. Itís easy to attack someone who canít defend himself anymore. You took my post to a thread I donít have access to, and then even put me under moderation, and start saying things about me, not giving me the chance to reply, defend, explain or excuse myself. How brave is that? Not brave at all! Thatís arbitrary cowardice, IMO.

I never meant to tell Brandon how to grieve or for how long. I know what losing a person is. I didnít mean to be insensitive to him, but things as they are. The fact that Brandon is a friend of the Yamin family and he is sorry for Claudetteís loss has nothing to do with my post, so donít hang on that to attack me and defend his attitude. He has all the right to grieve in the way he chooses and for the time he wants, and I donít doubt he really feels Caludetteís loss, as well as a personal loss of him that someone mentioned.

But thatís not excuse to ignore and neglect other peopleís feelings, and then rudely address to the other siteís manager, alluding that there are more important things to worry about. So thatís not insensitive towards her? Who decides what hurts more? Being violated in your privacy and being publicly mocked about it shouldn't have hurt Jackie because of Elliottís mom passing away? Should she had a long time for people to be okay before she expresses her frustration and pain at being stabbed by people she thought were her friends? I think not.

Iím really sorry all this converged at a painful time for Brandon, but objectively, he should have separated the things going on. The other siteís manager didnít address him the day after Claudette died, she addressed him more than a week after. Itís enough time, not for the pain to faint, but for people to get over it and somehow start functioning in the world again (if not, I should recommend him to see a shrink because he might be depressedÖ and Iím not joking or being ironic here, Iím being serious). Has it been his work, Iím not sure if his boss would have given that much time to avoid his responsibilities, he would have been expected to be back at work, in 100% of his capacity and concentration, two days after Claudetteís deathÖ especially considering she was a friendís mother, not his.

So, Brandon, if you read this, Iím sorry for your loss. But that doesnít give you an excuse to act the way you did, sorry if itís hard. But in your grieving process, you hurt a friend of mine, and thatís not right either.

Now, realitymom, if you could say that, when in my post I judged Elliottís grief? Point it that to me please. All I said about Elliott is he seemed to be doing ok when Brandon was still mourning, thatís not judging his personal process. In fact, I think Elliott should have been the one ďcaring about more important thingsĒ, but he was already on AI, and flying to Japan. So saying Brandon couldnít take care of that stuff because of the mourning and grieving is a lame excuse, IMO.

And finally, I donít appreciate you people saying Iím a bad fanÖ not that I care for what you think, of course. But do you know how much money, time, energy and tears have I wasted on him? You have no idea, so please stop talking BS.

Anyway, Iím pissed and frustrated right now. Pissed to now Elliottís official site is ran by a bunch of arrogant, narrow-minded, selfish cowards who only care about getting shoutie-outies rather than establishing a site where every fan would feel welcomeÖ youíre not looking for Elliottís best interest, but for yours. Havenít you realized more and more people quit posting at the Train every day? Donít you see how your attitude push people away? Translate that to fans Elliott lose. That will affect him eventually, because no label will invest in an artist with no fans.

E-Train is the official Elliott Yamin site so far, so every body should feel welcome to express their feelings, not being punished for doing so. Iím now under moderation, and I know of members that have been in the same position, or even banned, because of expressing their feelings and thoughts towards this site with the only aim to make it better for Elliott fans. But of course, the elite would always like to keep being the elite, right? Thatís selfish from you. And itís coward from you to attack someone who doesnít have a chance to stand for himself anymore.

Iím sorry for Elliott, because he has put his career in the hands of greedy harpies (I won't say any names, but those of you who fit the glove, then wear it). Hope he some day realizes how you act because he definitely would be better without fans like you people.

Also, I want to say this doesnít extend to every E-trainer. There are wonderful people here, and you know who you areÖ if you havenít left already.
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Back to being Liz, here.

I am sure this isn't going to be a popular posting and that is ok. I think that is only right that Jabu has his say.


Stay sweet.
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realitymom
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 11:59 AM


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1. No one was flamed. I thought his comment was rude & innappropriate & I said as much.

2. I have not called ANYONE a troll. Ever. Period.

3. I didn't know he was unable to reply in the thread. As far as I knew, he didn't care to respond.

4. The entire point being missed, is that NO ONE should judge someone elses' time to grieve, how they handle it or how situations are handled during that time. And the comments against Brandon inferred just that.

5. Posts are not popularity contests. They are expressions of an opinion. I gave mine, which didn't agree w/ yours & it becomes a bad thing? Interesting.

6. Jabu may very well be a fabulous guy, but his comment was not & I posted how I felt about it.

7. Etrain is a great fan site for people who love Elliott & his music and enjoy sharing it with one another. The overall feel of this site is happiness & love for all. We have no need for a private forum to bash other fan sites. We are open to ALL fans & WELCOME all fans. As for rose colored glasses, never owned a pair. But, I do try to see the poitive in everything, I prefer that to incessant snarking.

I could ignore your posts, act as tho you don't matter. But ya know what? While I disagree w/ some of your opinions, the fact of the matter is, you ARE a fan of Elliott. As am I. Ignoring you would be rude & I am not. But, I will NOT tolerate rude comments against people that I am friends w/ or against this site that has become a second home to me filled w/ people I consider family.

We all agree that Jackie being hurt was awful & never should have happened. But why attack Etrain in general? Or it's posters who STILL have NO CLUE what the hell ya'll are talking about? And, we don't need to know. Something that private is none of our dayum business. That issue should have been handled privately instead of put on a public forum where the majority of the posters had no knowledge of what was being discussed.


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Thanks to emjay for the gorgeous banner...loves ya girl!



ELLIOTT YAMIN IS MY AMERICAN IDOL!!
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chloewannabee
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 01:08 PM


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QUOTE (LilRedDevilLizzy @ May 30 2008, 12:38 PM)

1.E-Train no longer, maybe it never has, allows its members to speak freely. If you don't like something well too bad you have to keep it to your self. And I'm not specifically talking about the site though I am speaking of Elliott. We are all here because we love him but oh my if you dare to say that you didn't think that great of this song or that, uho h better watch out because you aren't allowed to criticize him/a performance/an outfit/ a particular hairstyle or anything else.

2.There is alot of hypocricy (sorry I know its misspelled) on this site. Case in point, that Kat bashing thread that went by by. Suddenly there is a horrible song by the two of them and we're all suppose to pretend that we adore Kat? Some of the ones that did the most trashing of her are now raving about how wonderful she is. They didn't change their opiniono f her, they are only saying so because of her connection to Elliott.

3.We are being made to be the bad, bad, fans and people in general, because we are saying our feelings, voicing our frustrations. And when we do, thats when threads get moved. I agree threads shouldn't be hijacked and taken over, but do not pretend there aren't concerns by moving the threads so its out of sight and out of mind.

1. In the past 2 years, I have seen plenty of posts, that were not all lollipops and roses. Matter of fact, I used to criticize Elliott's long hair rather often. No one ever kicked me out or deleted my posts.
2.I do believe that the Kat thread went away at the request of the original poster. That was her right. She felt, as I recall, that she had moved on. I haven't moved on, don't think I ever will, but I don't have the inclination to resurrect that particular thread. I have better things to think about. And truthfully, maybe some actually DID change their opinion of her after the song came out. I am pretty familiar with the avid bashers, and I haven't seen any of them, singing Kat's praises, so I don't think it's fair to label us all hypocrites.
3. I personally, don't think there are any "bad, bad, bad fans", and I don't think that the moving of a thread implies that, and I certainly have not heard anyone state that.


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Taratova
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 01:33 PM


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I am not a mod so I have an opinion I can post. I am just trying to look at this objectively.
First , this situation was not even started on the E-train and we are first individuals. Common sense dictates that the E-train site or even Brandon is not the person to involve to sort out the gossip and hurtful statements.

If anyone starts something on any other site , an AOL site for example,it is those persons involved who should answer only and should be resolved at that site regardless if they are E-trainers. I see everyone as an individual first.







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My soul was stirred. It took the voice of Elliott Yamin to wake up my senses and bring me back into the world of music.
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Berkana
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 02:01 PM


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Jabu, these insults, are things that are going to keep you in moderation:

QUOTE
"This is Jabu here. I want to reply to some of you, especially realitymom, who doesnít seem to keep things under reality that much. "

"But do you know how much money, time, energy and tears have I wasted on him? You have no idea, so please stop talking BS."

" Pissed to now Elliottís official site is ran by a bunch of arrogant, narrow-minded, selfish cowards who only care about getting shoutie-outies rather than establishing a site where every fan would feel welcomeÖ"

"Iím sorry for Elliott, because he has put his career in the hands of greedy harpies (I won't say any names, but those of you who fit the glove, then wear it). "


That's pretty rude Jabu. I know there's a language barrier, but you seem to know what you are talking about. The fact is that E-train is run by a lot of mods. Brandon being one, Brandon who knows Elliott, who was extremely close friends with Scott before idol hit, who was close to Claudette as well. Maybe the situation wasn't handled as it should have been, and I'm sorry for that. I'm sorry for what happened to Jackie. But since most of the E-train doesn't know what went on, they can't judge, they shouldn't judge. So bringing it out in the open like this, isn't going to help solve any problems, because frankly people don't know what went on.

Threads get moved usually because they get off-topic and are controversial to most posters. (Usually people have to pm the mods and ask for it to be removed.) However getting into OTR is much easier then getting into other boards private subforums. All you have to have is 10 posts, and have been here for a week to get into OTR. (And ask a mod.). That seems pretty fair to me, it's not like it's ultra exclusive.

I know certain people have had problems with the mods. But they make mistakes, just like you and I make mistakes. They are doing the best they can to run a board which is considered Elliott's official site. I have never had a problem with any of the mods (despite being a not-so-nice member at the beginning of the board days.), they've done the best they can. I personally think they've done a pretty good job, but Im not living with (as LilRedDevilLizzy like to refer to the members as wearing) rose colored glasses on, and know that things aren't always perfect.

Again I wish whatever mod it was would apologize to Jackie for the pain she was caused.

This post has been edited by Berkana on Jun 4 2008, 02:02 PM


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Can you picture a little boy, dragging wood down the lane?
Grandma waiting for him brother, playing outside in the rain
Each day we hear the score, before not after shots of war
And the road to him is love, but the love is never more

The Whitlams
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nanab
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 02:09 PM


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QUOTE (Berkana @ Jun 4 2008, 12:01 PM)
Jabu, these insults, are things that are going to keep you in moderation:

QUOTE
"This is Jabu here. I want to reply to some of you, especially realitymom, who doesnít seem to keep things under reality that much. "

"But do you know how much money, time, energy and tears have I wasted on him? You have no idea, so please stop talking BS."

" Pissed to now Elliottís official site is ran by a bunch of arrogant, narrow-minded, selfish cowards who only care about getting shoutie-outies rather than establishing a site where every fan would feel welcomeÖ"

"Iím sorry for Elliott, because he has put his career in the hands of greedy harpies (I won't say any names, but those of you who fit the glove, then wear it). "


That's pretty rude Jabu. I know there's a language barrier, but you seem to know what you are talking about. The fact is that E-train is run by a lot of mods. Brandon being one, Brandon who knows Elliott, who was extremely close friends with Scott before idol hit, who was close to Claudette as well. Maybe the situation wasn't handled as it should have been, and I'm sorry for that. I'm sorry for what happened to Jackie. But since most of the E-train doesn't know what went on, they can't judge, they shouldn't judge. So bringing it out in the open like this, isn't going to help solve any problems, because frankly people don't know what went on.

Threads get moved usually because they get off-topic and are controversial to most posters. (Usually people have to pm the mods and ask for it to be removed.) However getting into OTR is much easier then getting into other boards private subforums. All you have to have is 10 posts, and have been here for a week to get into OTR. (And ask a mod.). That seems pretty fair to me, it's not like it's ultra exclusive.

I know certain people have had problems with the mods. But they make mistakes, just like you and I make mistakes. They are doing the best they can to run a board which is considered Elliott's official site. I have never had a problem with any of the mods (despite being a not-so-nice member at the beginning of the board days.), they've done the best they can. I personally think they've done a pretty good job, but Im not living with (as LilRedDevilLizzy like to refer to the members as wearing) rose colored glasses on, and know that things aren't always perfect.

Again I wish whatever mod it was would apologize to Jackie for the pain she was caused.

Great post Berk....
PLEASE..PLEASE..PLEASE..take this to private PMs...
Berk is right..most of us don't even know what is going on..
Believe me I am currently involved in a horriable situation because of
gossip and misunderstandings...
You know the whole world is now coming to the Etrain...let's not hurt Elliott
who has given us his heart and soul...PLEASE..PLEASE..PLEASE...

edit to say.... grouphug2.gif

This post has been edited by nanab on Jun 4 2008, 02:10 PM


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LET THERE BE SONGS TO FILL THE AIR..
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yellin4yamin
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 02:29 PM


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I have to say this and then I am done, because someone has to defend this amazingly OPEN, WELCOMING, FRIENDLY, FUN place that has been like a second family to SO many over the past two years.

Shouldn't an official fan site represent Elliott in the same positive, loving, welcoming, appreciative manner that he has always given to us? I have been here since almost the beginning and I have NEVER, EVER known there to be anything but welcoming, loving, warm and friendly fans here. There is no one any better than anyone else, no matter how long you have been here, whether you are a mod or not, and we all have one common love..Elliott Yamin.

Jabu, you said this above:

"Anyway, Iím pissed and frustrated right now. Pissed to now Elliottís official site is ran by a bunch of arrogant, narrow-minded, selfish cowards who only care about getting shoutie-outies rather than establishing a site where every fan would feel welcomeÖ youíre not looking for Elliottís best interest, but for yours. Havenít you realized more and more people quit posting at the Train every day? Donít you see how your attitude push people away? Translate that to fans Elliott lose. That will affect him eventually, because no label will invest in an artist with no fans."

when has ANYONE here ever been arrogant, narrow-minded, or SELFISH? Why don't you ask our precious Amanda Rhea how "selfish" all of us are here, or Rian G when he had loss, or those who lost loved ones, or have gone through tough times, and have gotten cards, flowers, money, calls, e-mails, pm's, visits. We have donated money and time to the JDRF, we are there for each other during some very difficult times that people who are not members here might not even begin to realize. We have become a family, and one that graciously has always welcomed in ANY fan/friend of Elliott's. Getting a "shoutie-outtie"..whatever that means, never even comes into play here. We are all equal, we are all here for the same purpose, and we are no higher or mightier than anyone. We just enjoy trying to stay positive about things...like Elliott, and FOR Elliott. We are human, we all have our days, our moments, and I have never even seen your site let alone been there, but if you are there gathering for the common love of Elliott and supporting him..then wonderful;) Why are we so bad because we don't want to be disrespectful? I don't understand when being a good person..makes one so bad;( How could you ever say we are not looking out for Elliott's best interest, when he comes here himself on a regular basis, and is thankful for all the love we share and give. Who is leaving the etrain? I see the list of fans growing on a regular basis. I have been WAYYYYYYYYY beyond blessed to meet Elliott, and you have no idea how thankful he was for all the love, and support that he is given by his fans. He loves all of his fans. Here I am a big, not so beautiful woman, and most people in the business wouldn't give me the time of day and would be petty and ignorant and would be like "ewwwwwww". But Elliott is a much bigger man than that. He instantly sees PAST the outer person, and looks straight into their heart, and he lets you know how much you, and EVERYONE, is appreciated. He is a class-act, and so is everyone here.

As far as Brandon goes, if he himself was not involved with what happened to Jackie..which I still have no clue about but am truly sorry for, then how can you expect him to do anything about it? That would not be fair, or right to ask that of him, or any of the mods. It should be dealt with SOLELY with the person/people at hand. None of the rest of the 5000 + members should be drug into it if we were not there to see such an event happen. I heard through the grapvine that a long while back, a photo of Elliott and I was taken without permission to another fan site, I was cropped out of it, and I was rudely made fun of. This is the FIRST I have ever posted about this because what is bringing it up to a bunch of fans who have nothing to do with it going to do??? How would Elliott feel if HE had seen the photo cropped when he was gracious enough to take it, and people who had never, ever even met me, say not so nice things about me, when HE himself was nothing but kind, and considerate to me from the moment he met me...ALONG with everyone here? What good does doing something like that do? Why is THAT ok? I got over it and only mentioned it now to let everyone know that going on and on to people who have no clue will not solve anything. The only ones that can solve a problem fairly, truthfully, and in good faith are those involved. If they choose not to, that should not reflect on the rest of us that have no clue.

In my "perfect world" that is far from so, we would all just have fun, get along, and support Elliott. That is what a "fan" is supposed to do.

Fan in the dictionary says: a person who has an uncritical attachment

that is who I have always tried to be, and that is what his official fan site does and should stand for.

Can we ALL just go back to showing the respect and love he has for each and every one of us? In the end, that is what it is all about. Love you guys!!! grouphug2.gif

This post has been edited by yellin4yamin on Jun 4 2008, 02:30 PM


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user posted image
we are all shades of gray. it's been said again and again; life's a process. we are fleeting moments that come and go, and I'm grateful to have my time, my aspirations and mistakes, my flaws and my abilities. think of me what you will, but before you do, don't."
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estrayastar
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 02:34 PM


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QUOTE (LilRedDevilLizzy @ Jun 4 2008, 11:45 AM)
Iím sorry for Elliott, because he has put his career in the hands of greedy harpies (I won't say any names, but those of you who fit the glove, then wear it). Hope he some day realizes how you act because he definitely would be better without fans like you people.



Er, maybe I misread something, but your post was a bit hypocritical.
Don't complain about people calling you a troll (which one person did, and then SUDDENLYOMG it's everyone here) and then talk about how "bad" we are.

There are lots of things I like on Flipside, and I probably won't even be welcome there after I say this, but lots of the people there have banners and stuff that bash ETrain and talk about how bad it is over here. Nobody over here that I know of bashes your site, so just knock it off.

As for the thing with Jackie, I'm sorry it happened. But it's not everyone's fault - I didn't even know about it, and I'm sure most other people didn't either. I really think like some other people said that it should be handled in PMs.

I know it's just the internet, but I really like some of the people I've met here and don't like seeing them bashed for really no reason.

Just my opinionnn.

This post has been edited by estrayastar on Jun 4 2008, 02:36 PM


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chloewannabee
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 04:50 PM


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user posted image


chloestrain.gif chloestrain.gif chloestrain.gif chloestrain.gif chloestrain.gif


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musicmovesme
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 06:37 PM


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QUOTE (shatner8 @ May 30 2008, 09:15 PM)
Am been reading these posts with some interest, not understanding it all, but
as a long time member of the E train, it makes me just sad, just sad, and a bit confused how this has all transpired to hurt feelings, disappointments and violations of privacy, and misunderstandings. Tolerance is a powerful thing, imo and the ability to set aside differences for a common interest, for the promotionn of this guy, Mr Elliott Yamin, isn't that what this is all about? 
I am sorry that you have been hurt Jackie, I can feel your hurt, and have enjoyed your posts over the past several months, you seem like a really cool person I hope to meet someday.


Honestly, doesn't the E train have room for all of Elliott's fans, those who lust for him, those who want to mother him, the rainbow and flower people, the cynics, the amused. the disgruntled ?  heck, I have probably been all of these things, one time or another on this site.  I still adore the guy, but at times, I had questioned what is going on, what is coming next, etc, etc, etc,
At the end of the day, I am still his fan, pure and simple

Love this post, Shatner8. Seems to me this whole issue isn't about Elliott so much but about tolerance of other fans and their freedom to express opinions and treating each other with respect on various Elliott websites. There certainly have been violations on all the Elliott and AI sites I've been to. Would love to see how other fansites work but since this is an official site there probably has to be more moderation here than on the other Elliott sites because the tone of the site reflects on him more and there are all ages of fans visiting here. I can understand no over PG threads here and no extreme language if those are the rules. I have no problem with more adult oriented sites. Live and let live. At the same time there has to be some room for differing opinions, personalities and types of fans on E-Train or it will make his official site an exclusive place when it should be the most inclusive.

The problem with internet is the only mode of communication on it is the written word and unless we've met, we start out here either as strangers or acquaintances at best. After awhile it seems like we get to know each other and trust that the person writing is really a loyal fan so we make allowances like you would for a friend and people start to communicate more openly and freely. I'm sure there have been things written by long term E-Trainers that probably would have been taken to task if they were not so well known on the site and I've seen E-Trainers who were not writing in English as a first language get defended when they posted something that was misunderstood. This is natural for regulars since we know things about each other--a fan might be having a bad day or have a good reason to feel frustrated and it is understood and taken into account with the whole that we know about the person. I wouldn't expect you to know Jabu but I do from other sites and he has been a loyal fan from the very beginning of Elliott's stint on AI which hasn't been easy being in Peru with no access to the E man other than via internet and other internet fans and sites. Most of us fans in the U.S. (and in some parts of Asia) have actually been able to see him perform live, meet him and get a hug, handshake or autograph or just hear him on the radio and in stores and restaurants. We can talk about Elliott with other fans and our families and go buy any of his cd's on first day of release. Anyway, guess what I'm trying to say is the internet communication by Elliott (blogging or video) and the relative state of his internet fansites is of more concern and matters alot more to this guy and other international fans who are otherwise left out of the loop.

There are good fans who are uncritical of Elliott and good fans who question what he does (out of concern for his career). Some bluntly speak their minds or may not be (or know how to be) diplomatic in writing and it may come off as offensive but it isn't the same as being a troll which is being purposely against Elliott and stirring up trouble for him. The people on E-Train and also those that run other sites like Y-Pod and Flipside are volunteers who share of their own time, talent and resources because they are interested and care about Elliott. He is lucky to have so many caring fans and a variety of fansites...of course it seems he deserves them and it would be great if his fans got along together--we don't have to like or agree with each other just get along.

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realitymom
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 08:36 PM


E-Train's Favorite Dose of REALITY
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Group: Passengers
Posts: 3,158
Member No.: 46
Joined: 18-May 06



QUOTE (chloewannabee @ Jun 4 2008, 04:50 PM)
user posted image


chloestrain.gif  chloestrain.gif  chloestrain.gif  chloestrain.gif  chloestrain.gif

Perfectly said choe. awe.gif

I think we are all in serious E withdrawal. As E addicts, this is very unhealthy & quite scary. PLEASE E, HELP US ALL!! Feed the addiction! girly.gif

This post has been edited by realitymom on Jun 4 2008, 08:37 PM


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Thanks to emjay for the gorgeous banner...loves ya girl!



ELLIOTT YAMIN IS MY AMERICAN IDOL!!
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KittyloverforElliott
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 09:06 PM


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MMM, you kind of summed up what needed to be said. I applaud you for voicing it so well. I love Elliott and being an Elliott fan and I think there is room for many kinds of sites. The moderators and administrators of each board have a difficult job and must run the board in the way they think works best.

This post has been edited by KittyloverforElliott on Jun 4 2008, 09:07 PM


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His voice is like liquid chocolate, incredibly smooth and controlled
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yellin4yamin
Posted: Jun 4 2008, 09:14 PM


E-train's Own Funky Drummer Girl
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Group: Passengers
Posts: 4,510
Member No.: 497
Joined: 19-May 06



oh, oh and .....

user posted image

user posted image

user posted image

user posted image

user posted image

the reason WE ALL are fans;)


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user posted image
we are all shades of gray. it's been said again and again; life's a process. we are fleeting moments that come and go, and I'm grateful to have my time, my aspirations and mistakes, my flaws and my abilities. think of me what you will, but before you do, don't."
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onlyforelliott
Posted: Jun 5 2008, 05:54 AM


ETrain Engineer
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Group: Passengers
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Joined: 30-May 06



It's interesting that a topic about staying on topic has veered off in so many different directions and addressed so many different topics.

In my view, some of the allegations against the Etrain are so far fetched that they are not worthy of defense.

There is one that I do know a lot about, and since it has been brought up several times, I'll admit my role in that. I know that there are people here that intensely dislike, perhaps even hate, Kat. I happen to like her. I got upset with the constant negativity and derogatory nicknames that I actually stopped posting on the Etrain. After nearly two months, I decided that if I thought it was wrong then I should at least try to do something about. I started posting in the Kat topic in OTR. I wish I would have saved the entire series of post that led to the eventual locking of the topic but I did not. Different opinions were expressed and I believe handled with respect. Other members of Etrain joined in the discussion. There were some very good posts written my people explaining individual perceptions and perspectives. The original poster of that thread made a statement that she was ready to move on. I don't remember her exact statement but it was something to the effect that she considered the topic closed. The thread was locked a short time later.

I support the moderators and I would be happy if they exerted their authority more often. But they can only do this effectively if there are written guidelines to cite in situations in which their decisions are disputed. Members who have disagreements, and I have seen far fewer of them on the Etrain than any other site I visited regularly, will have a point of reference if there are guidelines. When all members are aware of abiding by the same guidelines, moderation becomes internal among the members rather than external through a moderator.
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bigEfan
Posted: Jun 5 2008, 07:17 AM


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QUOTE (estrayastar @ Jun 4 2008, 01:34 PM)
There are lots of things I like on Flipside, and I probably won't even be welcome there after I say this, but lots of the people there have banners and stuff that bash ETrain and talk about how bad it is over here. Nobody over here that I know of bashes your site, so just knock it off.

As for the thing with Jackie, I'm sorry it happened. But it's not everyone's fault - I didn't even know about it, and I'm sure most other people didn't either. I really think like some other people said that it should be handled in PMs.

I know it's just the internet, but I really like some of the people I've met here and don't like seeing them bashed for really no reason.


Ummm, sorry but there has never been a "banner" or even a siggy bashing the Etrain in general at the Flipside. Has there been some snarky siggy's or avie's stating an individual thought or feeling? Yes. But, it's that persons right and the Flipside is not an official site and stuff like snarkiness among other things are allowed.

Over and over again, I have seen posts in this thread as well as the others about the topic specifically state it was NOT meant for everyone here. And it has been repeated that is was attempted to resolve via pm's multiple times. How much more clearer can someone be? Honestly.

As far as "being bashed for no reason"....if you don't know the whole story, or haven't bothered to read the posts that explained what went on or you were not the one hurt, then, where do you get off telling someone how to feel and/or react? I don't consider it "bashing" by stating one's thoughts and feelings on a specific topic.

Once again, just cuz apparently it has NOT been stated clearly enough. The problems that have been discussed have not been directed at the Etrain in general or against every darn member. I can really only speak for myself but I've seen it in posts repeatedly other than my own. I myself thought Jabu's posts were a bit on the harsh side and I don't agree with some of the things he had posted. Matter of fact, I told him so. But, I respect his thoughts & feelings and he respected mine. And I can see why some would feel the etrain itself was being attacked. I don't have to agree with everything or anything anyone posts here or at any other fan site for that matter. But, I can respect their thoughts, feelings, and opinions as an individual.

I'm an Elliott fan #1. But, like in the "real" world there are some people we like and get along with more than others. It doesn't mean I dislike an entire group just because of a few "bad apples" so to speak. And just because I don't agree with anything and everything that is said and done here or any other fansite doesn't mean I love Elliott any less either.

Chloe & Yellin-love the pics! ROWR!

MMM-excellent, thoughtful post.


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Priceless quote by bigEfan after just hearing Elliott sing live, " I officially love Elliott Yamin MORE than I EVER have!"
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estrayastar
Posted: Jun 5 2008, 01:49 PM


ETrain Operator
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Joined: 15-January 07



QUOTE (bigEfan @ Jun 5 2008, 08:17 AM)
QUOTE (estrayastar @ Jun 4 2008, 01:34 PM)
There are lots of things I like on Flipside, and I probably won't even be welcome there after I say this, but lots of the people there have banners and stuff that bash ETrain and talk about how bad it is over here. Nobody over here that I know of bashes your site, so just knock it off.

As for the thing with Jackie, I'm sorry it happened. But it's not everyone's fault - I didn't even know about it, and I'm sure most other people didn't either. I really think like some other people said that it should be handled in PMs.

I know it's just the internet, but I really like some of the people I've met here and don't like seeing them bashed for really no reason.


Ummm, sorry but there has never been a "banner" or even a siggy bashing the Etrain in general at the Flipside. Has there been some snarky siggy's or avie's stating an individual thought or feeling? Yes. But, it's that persons right and the Flipside is not an official site and stuff like snarkiness among other things are allowed.

Over and over again, I have seen posts in this thread as well as the others about the topic specifically state it was NOT meant for everyone here. And it has been repeated that is was attempted to resolve via pm's multiple times. How much more clearer can someone be? Honestly.

As far as "being bashed for no reason"....if you don't know the whole story, or haven't bothered to read the posts that explained what went on or you were not the one hurt, then, where do you get off telling someone how to feel and/or react? I don't consider it "bashing" by stating one's thoughts and feelings on a specific topic.

Once again, just cuz apparently it has NOT been stated clearly enough. The problems that have been discussed have not been directed at the Etrain in general or against every darn member. I can really only speak for myself but I've seen it in posts repeatedly other than my own. I myself thought Jabu's posts were a bit on the harsh side and I don't agree with some of the things he had posted. Matter of fact, I told him so. But, I respect his thoughts & feelings and he respected mine. And I can see why some would feel the etrain itself was being attacked. I don't have to agree with everything or anything anyone posts here or at any other fan site for that matter. But, I can respect their thoughts, feelings, and opinions as an individual.

I'm an Elliott fan #1. But, like in the "real" world there are some people we like and get along with more than others. It doesn't mean I dislike an entire group just because of a few "bad apples" so to speak. And just because I don't agree with anything and everything that is said and done here or any other fansite doesn't mean I love Elliott any less either.

Chloe & Yellin-love the pics! ROWR!

MMM-excellent, thoughtful post.

I call the image siggys banners, I didn't mean banner as in the image on the top... I didn't mean to make it sound that way. I have seen siggys that were directed at ETrain though, but it was only one or two. I just mean nobody over here talks bad at about Flipside (though most people here don't even know what it is or have even been.)

And sorry to sound like a broken record - lots of people were saying how they felt about what happened, and I thought I should stay sort of on topic because that's one of the things that's been talked about.

I do know what happened, or at least I think so. Somebody went into Flipside and found out really personal stuff about Jackie, then decided to share it at a lunch with other Etrainers. Or that's what I've seen posted about it anyway. You are right that I haven't read EVERY post, but just skimmed through some. That's not the point though, and I never said how she should've reacted. She probably handled it better than I would've had something like that happened to me. I understand people have different ways of handling things and lots of the time there is no "right" way to react.

For the lumping thing it was more directed at Jabu. I probably read it wrong, but when he said "awful fans like you people" I thought he meant ETrainers. Now that I've read it over maybe he meant mods? I'm not sure.



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bigEfan
Posted: Jun 7 2008, 12:34 PM


ETrain Engineer
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Group: Passengers
Posts: 1,049
Member No.: 217
Joined: 18-May 06



Testing testing...the site seems messed up so seeing what's going on.


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Priceless quote by bigEfan after just hearing Elliott sing live, " I officially love Elliott Yamin MORE than I EVER have!"
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nanassetta
Posted: Jun 8 2008, 06:55 AM


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user posted image


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Nancy
user posted image
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bigEfan
Posted: Jun 8 2008, 06:05 PM


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QUOTE (nanassetta @ Jun 8 2008, 05:55 AM)
user posted image

Nancy, I really like ya...and have appreciated your hard work in the News thread. You are also one great Elliott fan. So, please don't think I'm being disrepectful and please correct me if I'm interpreting this wrong but....

I'm just hoping this pic with that quote doesn't insinuate that some of the Flipside members "gave up" or someone "won" on the issues discussed in this thread because of some of the posts in here. Cuz, it's far from the truth...the reason is cuz it gets darn boring repeating yourself over and over again, and people just don't read, comprehend or get it. It's kinda like beating your head against a wall....after awhile it gives you a headache. Period.

ETA-that sure is a purty white tiger tho. smile.gif

This post has been edited by bigEfan on Jun 8 2008, 06:33 PM


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Priceless quote by bigEfan after just hearing Elliott sing live, " I officially love Elliott Yamin MORE than I EVER have!"
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